Netflix VPN detection - actual engineer needed

Fri Jun 3 22:18:46 UTC 2016

ISPs should not be in the business of helping distributors come up with “novel ways” to help them regionalize.  It’s counterproductive to the ISPs main purpose which is to get their customers “the whole Internet”, from anywhere to anywhere no matter where you are.

As far as TV channels, that is an unrelated issue because they have their own distribution network, they can freely choose what cable systems and what satellite systems they want to license to.  What you are NOT allowed to do is impose new requirements on our Internet to support your business licensing models and make it our problem.  This is no different than someone like Microsoft saying “hey service providers, we don’t want you to carry any network traffic from illegal copies of Outlook” and expecting us to figure it out.  I know as service providers we have to be sensitive to our customers but Netflix is also a service provider and should be taking the heat from their own customers.  Netflix authored a broken process and now we should be expected to re-engineer the network to eliminate V6 tunnel brokers?!?!?!  I don’t think so Netflix.

If I was still an ISP today, I would be sending all of my customers a memo explaining how badly Netflix VPN detection works and why it is so hard for us to help with it and why they should be complaining to Netflix.

Steven Naslund

From: Cryptographrix [mailto:cryptographrix at gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, June 03, 2016 5:06 PM
To: Naslund, Steve; nanog at nanog.org
Subject: Re: Netflix VPN detection - actual engineer needed

There's really no point in whining about content providers and regionalization as long as TV channels are still a thing.

I get that the internet totally annihilated borders of all kind (including the book store), but some businesses change slower than others, and content production is still back in the black-and-white TV days because even new content producers don't have that new of a business model.

But nor are ISPs coming up with novel ways for distributors to offer more reliable regionalization services (and most of them were in the content regionalization business long before the Internet came around).

Pick one of those two problems and make a business to solve them.

Until then, Netflix's developers could at least use the "novel" solution of tiering the most accurate forms of location before hitting IP geolocation.

On Fri, Jun 3, 2016 at 5:52 PM Naslund, Steve <SNaslund at medline.com<mailto:SNaslund at medline.com>> wrote:
Actually it's time for Netflix to get out of the network transport business and tell the content providers to get over it or not get carried on Netflix.  It used to be that Netflix needed content providers, now I am starting to believe it might be the other way around.  Netflix might have to take a page from the satellite guys and start calling them out publicly.  i.e. "Netflix will no longer be able to provide you with Warner Bros. content because they are dinosaurs that are worried that someone might be watching in the wrong country.  We are pleased to offer you content from producers that are not complete morons...."

As the content producers lose more and more control over the distribution channel they are going to take whatever terms are necessary to get them on Netflix, Apple TV, Comcast, Time Warner, DirecTV and Dish.  If you are not on any or all of those platforms, you are going to be dead meat.   Who would be hurt worse, Netflix or the movie producer that got seen nowhere on their latest film.  To me, this is the last gasp of an industry that lost control of its distribution channel years ago and is still trying to impose that control.

Steven Naslund

-----Original Message-----
From: NANOG [mailto:nanog-bounces at nanog.org<mailto:nanog-bounces at nanog.org>] On Behalf Of Mark Andrews
Sent: Friday, June 03, 2016 4:28 PM
To: Laszlo Hanyecz
Cc: nanog at nanog.org<mailto:nanog at nanog.org>
Subject: Re: Netflix VPN detection - actual engineer needed

It's time for Netflix to offer IPv6 tunnels.  That way they can correlate IPv4 and IPv6 addresses.  Longest match will result is the correct source address being selected if they do the job correctly.

--
Mark Andrews, ISC
1 Seymour St., Dundas Valley, NSW 2117, Australia
PHONE: +61 2 9871 4742                 INTERNET: marka at isc.org<mailto:marka at isc.org>