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<p class="MsoNormal">When working with ILECs it is important to differentiate what must be offered via ICAs and what is offered commercially. We for example sell a ton commercially but effectively none through our interconnection agreements anymore.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">(we being Ziply Fiber in WA/OR/ID/MT)<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> NANOG <nanog-bounces+john=vanoppen.com@nanog.org>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Mike Hammett<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, July 22, 2022 2:24 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Paul Timmins <paul@telcodata.us><br>
<b>Cc:</b> nanog@nanog.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: Frontier Dark Fiber<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">Here's the list of CLLI codes where you're no longer able to order dark fiber:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">https://www.fcc.gov/clli-code-list<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">It seems odd as I look through there, finding COs with no competitive fiber and yet, they're on the list.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"><br>
<br>
-----<br>
Mike Hammett<br>
Intelligent Computing Solutions<br>
http://www.ics-il.com<br>
<br>
Midwest-IX<br>
http://www.midwest-ix.com<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">From:
</span></b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">"Paul Timmins" <paul@telcodata.us><br>
<b>To: </b>nanog@nanog.org<br>
<b>Sent: </b>Thursday, July 14, 2022 1:45:37 PM<br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: Frontier Dark Fiber<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">Your rights under the ICA are dead. Since 2002 you were only able to order it if one end was in a tier 3 wirecenter, and it was killed in 2021 as an orderable product.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black"><a href="https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2021/01/08/2020-25254/modernizing-unbundling-and-resale-requirements-in-an-era-of-next-generation-networks-and-services" target="_blank">https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2021/01/08/2020-25254/modernizing-unbundling-and-resale-requirements-in-an-era-of-next-generation-networks-and-services</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">There's an 8 year transition for existing unbundled dark fiber (February 28, 2029). Dark fiber loops were dead in 2002 under the TRRO.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">On 7/13/22 07:45, Mike Hammett wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">Oh, and I forgot to mention that my ICA has it.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><br>
<br>
-----<br>
Mike Hammett<br>
</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"><a href="http://www.ics-il.com/" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Intelligent Computing Solutions</span></a></span><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><br>
</span><a href="https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="100" height="100" style="width:1.0416in;height:1.0416in" id="Picture_x0020_2" src="cid:~WRD1903.jpg" alt="Image removed by sender."></span></a><a href="https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="100" height="100" style="width:1.0416in;height:1.0416in" id="Picture_x0020_3" src="cid:~WRD1903.jpg" alt="Image removed by sender."></span></a><a href="https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="100" height="100" style="width:1.0416in;height:1.0416in" id="Picture_x0020_4" src="cid:~WRD1903.jpg" alt="Image removed by sender."></span></a><a href="https://twitter.com/ICSIL" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="100" height="100" style="width:1.0416in;height:1.0416in" id="Picture_x0020_5" src="cid:~WRD1903.jpg" alt="Image removed by sender."></span></a><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><br>
</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"><a href="http://www.midwest-ix.com/" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Midwest Internet Exchange</span></a></span><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><br>
</span><a href="https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="100" height="100" style="width:1.0416in;height:1.0416in" id="Picture_x0020_6" src="cid:~WRD1903.jpg" alt="Image removed by sender."></span></a><a href="https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="100" height="100" style="width:1.0416in;height:1.0416in" id="Picture_x0020_7" src="cid:~WRD1903.jpg" alt="Image removed by sender."></span></a><a href="https://twitter.com/mdwestix" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="100" height="100" style="width:1.0416in;height:1.0416in" id="Picture_x0020_8" src="cid:~WRD1903.jpg" alt="Image removed by sender."></span></a><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><br>
</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"><a href="http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">The Brothers WISP</span></a></span><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><br>
</span><a href="https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="100" height="100" style="width:1.0416in;height:1.0416in" id="Picture_x0020_9" src="cid:~WRD1903.jpg" alt="Image removed by sender."></span></a><a href="https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="100" height="100" style="width:1.0416in;height:1.0416in" id="Picture_x0020_10" src="cid:~WRD1903.jpg" alt="Image removed by sender."></span></a><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">From:
</span></b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">"Mike Hammett"
<a href="mailto:nanog@ics-il.net" target="_blank"><nanog@ics-il.net></a><br>
<b>To: </b><a href="mailto:nanog@nanog.org" target="_blank">nanog@nanog.org</a><br>
<b>Sent: </b>Wednesday, July 13, 2022 6:40:47 AM<br>
<b>Subject: </b>Frontier Dark Fiber<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black;background:white">I'm looking for a contact at Frontier that can discuss dark fiber.</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">My current account exec says they don't offer it, yet prior conversations with him and a previous SE revealed that they very much did (just didn't have availability
on the paths I wanted at the time).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">Their web site highlights it fairly proudly.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">I'm aware that availability varies.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">I'm aware that they likely don't want to sell it.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<br>
-----<br>
Mike Hammett<br>
</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"><a href="http://www.ics-il.com/" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Intelligent Computing Solutions</span></a></span><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><br>
</span><a href="https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="100" height="100" style="width:1.0416in;height:1.0416in" id="Picture_x0020_12" src="cid:~WRD1903.jpg" alt="Image removed by sender."></span></a><a href="https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="100" height="100" style="width:1.0416in;height:1.0416in" id="Picture_x0020_13" src="cid:~WRD1903.jpg" alt="Image removed by sender."></span></a><a href="https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="100" height="100" style="width:1.0416in;height:1.0416in" id="Picture_x0020_14" src="cid:~WRD1903.jpg" alt="Image removed by sender."></span></a><a href="https://twitter.com/ICSIL" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="100" height="100" style="width:1.0416in;height:1.0416in" id="Picture_x0020_15" src="cid:~WRD1903.jpg" alt="Image removed by sender."></span></a><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><br>
</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"><a href="http://www.midwest-ix.com/" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Midwest Internet Exchange</span></a></span><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><br>
</span><a href="https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="100" height="100" style="width:1.0416in;height:1.0416in" id="Picture_x0020_16" src="cid:~WRD1903.jpg" alt="Image removed by sender."></span></a><a href="https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="100" height="100" style="width:1.0416in;height:1.0416in" id="Picture_x0020_17" src="cid:~WRD1903.jpg" alt="Image removed by sender."></span></a><a href="https://twitter.com/mdwestix" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="100" height="100" style="width:1.0416in;height:1.0416in" id="Picture_x0020_18" src="cid:~WRD1903.jpg" alt="Image removed by sender."></span></a><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><br>
</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"><a href="http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">The Brothers WISP</span></a></span><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><br>
</span><a href="https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="100" height="100" style="width:1.0416in;height:1.0416in" id="Picture_x0020_19" src="cid:~WRD1903.jpg" alt="Image removed by sender."></span></a><a href="https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="100" height="100" style="width:1.0416in;height:1.0416in" id="Picture_x0020_20" src="cid:~WRD1903.jpg" alt="Image removed by sender."></span></a><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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