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<p>"You have to let your customer's services contain death threats
against the owner of your company or we'll blacklist you" is the
wildest take of 2021 yet.</p>
<p>Blocking Amazon because of who they allow to remain a customer is
something I wholeheartedly encourage my competitors to do.<br>
</p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 1/12/21 9:29 AM, Kevin McCormick
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:f75836cc23964e6197efba2734894c03@mdtc.net">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Imagine
if Tier 1 ISPs had a censorship free clause that required
companies like Twitter, Facebook, and Amazon to provide
services free of censorship or have IP blocks blackholed.
They would lose hundreds of millions of dollars per day. I
bet they would reverse their tone in a hurry.<br>
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/idaho-internet-provider-to-block-facebook-twitter-over-their-trump-bans/">https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/idaho-internet-provider-to-block-facebook-twitter-over-their-trump-bans/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Thank
you,<br>
<br>
Kevin McCormick<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">
NANOG
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:nanog-bounces+kmccormick=mdtc.net@nanog.org"><nanog-bounces+kmccormick=mdtc.net@nanog.org></a>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>mark seery<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, January 10, 2021 8:06 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> K. Scott Helms <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:kscott.helms@gmail.com"><kscott.helms@gmail.com></a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> NANOG Operators' Group
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:nanog@nanog.org"><nanog@nanog.org></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: Parler<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">I assume multiple networks/ ISPs that have
acceptable use policies that call out criminality and
incitement to violence, for example:<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a
href="https://www.xfinity.com/support/articles/comcast-acceptable-use-policy"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://www.xfinity.com/support/articles/comcast-acceptable-use-policy</a><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">Have these
AUPs been invoked previously for these reasons, or would
that be new territory?<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Sent from Mobile Device<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">On Jan
10, 2021, at 2:52 PM, K. Scott Helms <<a
href="mailto:kscott.helms@gmail.com"
moz-do-not-send="true">kscott.helms@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</blockquote>
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<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Right, it's not a list for content
hosting.<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Scott Helms<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On Sun, Jan 10, 2021, 5:42 PM
<<a href="mailto:sronan@ronan-online.com"
moz-do-not-send="true">sronan@ronan-online.com</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
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<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">No,
this is a list for Network Operators.<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Sent from my iPhone<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">On Jan 10, 2021,
at 5:32 PM, K. Scott Helms <<a
href="mailto:kscott.helms@gmail.com"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">kscott.helms@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</blockquote>
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style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">This is a list for
pushing bits. The fact that many/most of us
have other businesses doesn't make this an
appropriate forum for SIP issues (to use my
own work as an example).<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On Sun, Jan 10, 2021,
4:52 PM <<a
href="mailto:sronan@ronan-online.com"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">sronan@ronan-online.com</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
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style="border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC
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<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">This is a
list for Network Operators, AWS
certainly operates networks.<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Sent from my iPhone<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">On Jan
10, 2021, at 4:27 PM, K. Scott Helms
<<a
href="mailto:kscott.helms@gmail.com"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">kscott.helms@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">No,<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">It really
does not. Section 230 only
applies to publishers, and not
to network providers. If this
were a cloud hosting provider
list then you'd be correct,
but as a network provider's
list it does not belong here.<br>
<br>
<br clear="all">
<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">Scott Helms<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On Sun, Jan
10, 2021 at 3:21 PM Lady
Benjamin PD Cannon <<a
href="mailto:ben@6by7.net"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">ben@6by7.net</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
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style="border:none;border-left:solid
#CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in
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<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">As
network operations and
compute/cloud/hosting
operations continue to
coalesce, I very much
disagree with you. Section
230 is absolutely relevant,
this discussion is timely
and relevant, and it
directly affects me as both
a telecom and cloud
compute/services provider. <o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">—L.B.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">Lady
Benjamin PD
Cannon, ASCE<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">6x7
Networks &
6x7 Telecom,
LLC <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">CEO <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black"><a
href="mailto:ben@6by7.net" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">ben@6by7.net</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">"The
only fully
end-to-end
encrypted global
telecommunications company in the world.”<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">FCC
License KJ6FJJ<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black"><br>
<br>
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><Speedtest9118.png><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><Ben
LIC.png><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On
Jan 10, 2021, at
12:13 PM, K. Scott
Helms <<a
href="mailto:kscott.helms@gmail.com"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">kscott.helms@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">It's
not, and frankly
it's disappointing
to see people
pushing an agenda
here.<br>
<br>
<br>
Scott Helms<br>
<br>
<br>
On Sun, Jan 10,
2021 at 9:37 AM
<<a
href="mailto:sronan@ronan-online.com"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">sronan@ronan-online.com</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p
class="MsoNormal"><br>
NANOG is a group
of Operators,
discussion does
not have to be
about
networking. I
have already
explained how
this represents
a significant
issue for
Network
Operators.<br>
<br>
On Jan 10, 2021,
at 9:09 AM, Mike
Bolitho <<a
href="mailto:mikebolitho@gmail.com"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">mikebolitho@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
<br>
<span
style="font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"></span><br>
It has nothing
to do with
networking.
Their decision
was necessarily
political. If
you can
specifically
bring up an
issue, beyond
speculative, on
how their new
chosen CDN is
somehow now
causing
congestion or
routing issues
on the public
internet, then
great. But as of
now, that isn't
even a thing.
It's just best
to leave it
alone because it
will devolve
into chaos.<br>
<br>
- Mike Bolitho<br>
<br>
On Sun, Jan 10,
2021, 6:54 AM
<<a
href="mailto:sronan@ronan-online.com"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">sronan@ronan-online.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p
class="MsoNormal"><br>
Why? This is
extremely
relevant to
network
operators and
is not
political at
all.<br>
<br>
On Jan 10,
2021, at 8:51
AM, Mike
Bolitho <<a
href="mailto:mikebolitho@gmail.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">mikebolitho@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
<br>
<span
style="font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"></span><br>
Can we please
not go down
this rabbit
hole on here?
List admins?<br>
<br>
- Mike Bolitho<br>
<br>
On Sun, Jan
10, 2021, 1:26
AM William
Herrin <<a
href="mailto:bill@herrin.us" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">bill@herrin.us</a>>
wrote:<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p
class="MsoNormal"><br>
Anybody
looking for a
new customer
opportunity?
It seems
Parler is in<br>
search of a
new service
provider.
Vendors need
only provide
all the<br>
proprietary
AWS APIs that
Parler depends
upon to
function.<br>
<br>
<a
href="https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2021/01/09/amazon-parler-suspension/"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2021/01/09/amazon-parler-suspension/</a><br>
<br>
Regards,<br>
Bill HErrin<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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