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    Ca, taking a self-originated default route (with or without an
    additional partial view of the global routing table) from your
    transit provider's edge router seems to make the assumption that
    your transit provider's edge router either has a full table or a
    working default route itself. In the case of transit provider
    outages (planned or unplanned), the transit provider's edge router
    that you peer with may be up and reachable (and generating a default
    route to your routers), but may not have connectivity to the greater
    internet. Put another way, if your own routers don't have a full
    routing table then they don't have enough information to make
    intelligent routing decisions and are offloading that responsibility
    onto the transit provider. IMHO, what's the point of being
    multi-homed if you can't make intelligent routing decisions and
    provide routing redundancy in the case of a transit provider outage?<br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">Mike Hammett wrote on 5/15/2019 2:19
      PM:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
      cite="mid:400065099.3557.1557947984364.JavaMail.mhammett@ThunderFuck">
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      <div style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:
        10pt; color: #000000">As an eyeball network myself, you'll
        probably want to look at those things. You don't need to run a
        CDN to know where your bits are going.<br>
        <br>
        <div><span name="x"></span><br>
          <br>
          -----<br>
          Mike Hammett<br>
          Intelligent Computing Solutions<br>
          <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.ics-il.com">http://www.ics-il.com</a><br>
          <br>
          Midwest-IX<br>
          <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.midwest-ix.com">http://www.midwest-ix.com</a><span name="x"></span><br>
        </div>
        <br>
        <hr id="zwchr">
        <div
style="color:#000;font-weight:normal;font-style:normal;text-decoration:none;font-family:Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;font-size:12pt;"><b>From:
          </b>"Ca By" <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:cb.list6@gmail.com"><cb.list6@gmail.com></a><br>
          <b>To: </b>"Mike Hammett" <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:nanog@ics-il.net"><nanog@ics-il.net></a><br>
          <b>Cc: </b>"Dan White" <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:dwhite@olp.net"><dwhite@olp.net></a>,
          <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:nanog@nanog.org">nanog@nanog.org</a><br>
          <b>Sent: </b>Wednesday, May 15, 2019 2:14:21 PM<br>
          <b>Subject: </b>Re: BGP prefix filter list<br>
          <br>
          <div><br>
          </div>
          <div><br>
            <div class="gmail_quote">
              <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, May 15, 2019 at
                11:52 AM Mike Hammett <<a
                  href="mailto:nanog@ics-il.net" target="_blank"
                  moz-do-not-send="true">nanog@ics-il.net</a>> wrote:<br>
              </div>
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                .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
                <div>
                  <div
style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:10pt;color:#000000">You
                    can't do uRPF if you're not taking full routes.</div>
                </div>
              </blockquote>
              <div dir="auto"><br>
              </div>
              <div dir="auto">I would never do uRPF , i am not a transit
                shop, so no problem there. BCP38 is as sexy as i get. </div>
              <div dir="auto"><br>
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              <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
                .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
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                  <div
style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:10pt;color:#000000">
                    <div><br>
                    </div>
                    <div>You also have a more limited set of information
                      for analytics if you don't have full routes.<br>
                      <br>
                      <div><span></span></div>
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              </blockquote>
              <div dir="auto"><br>
              </div>
              <div dir="auto">Yep, i don’t run a sophisticate internet
                 CDN either. Just pumping packets from eyeballs to
                clouds and back, mostly. </div>
              <div dir="auto"><br>
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              <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
                .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
                <div>
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style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:10pt;color:#000000">
                    <div>
                      <div><br>
                        <br>
                        -----<br>
                        Mike Hammett<br>
                        Intelligent Computing Solutions<br>
                        <a href="http://www.ics-il.com" target="_blank"
                          moz-do-not-send="true">http://www.ics-il.com</a><br>
                        <br>
                        Midwest-IX<br>
                        <a href="http://www.midwest-ix.com"
                          target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">http://www.midwest-ix.com</a><span></span><br>
                      </div>
                      <br>
                      <hr id="m_-1825445705496325099zwchr">
                      <div
style="color:#000;font-weight:normal;font-style:normal;text-decoration:none;font-family:Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;font-size:12pt"><b>From:
                        </b>"Ca By" <<a
                          href="mailto:cb.list6@gmail.com"
                          target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">cb.list6@gmail.com</a>><br>
                        <b>To: </b>"Dan White" <<a
                          href="mailto:dwhite@olp.net" target="_blank"
                          moz-do-not-send="true">dwhite@olp.net</a>><br>
                        <b>Cc: </b><a href="mailto:nanog@nanog.org"
                          target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">nanog@nanog.org</a><br>
                        <b>Sent: </b>Wednesday, May 15, 2019 1:50:41 PM</div>
                    </div>
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style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:10pt;color:#000000">
                    <div>
                      <div
style="color:#000;font-weight:normal;font-style:normal;text-decoration:none;font-family:Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;font-size:12pt"><br>
                        <b>Subject: </b>Re: BGP prefix filter list<br>
                        <br>
                        <div><br>
                        </div>
                        <div><br>
                          <div class="gmail_quote">
                            <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed,
                              May 15, 2019 at 7:27 AM Dan White <<a
                                href="mailto:dwhite@olp.net"
                                target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">dwhite@olp.net</a>>
                              wrote:<br>
                            </div>
                            <blockquote class="gmail_quote"
                              style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px
                              #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">On
                              05/15/19 13:58 +0000, Phil Lavin wrote:<br>
                              >> We're an eyeball network. We
                              accept default routes from our transit<br>
                              >> providers so in theory there
                              should be no impact on reachability.<br>
                              >><br>
                              >> I'm pretty concerned about things
                              that I don't know due to inefficient<br>
                              >> routing, e.g. customers hitting a
                              public anycast DNS server in the wrong<br>
                              >> location resulting in Geolocation
                              issues.<br>
                              ><br>
                              >Ah! Understood. The default route(s)
                              was the bit I missed. Makes a lot of<br>
                              >sense if you can't justify buying new
                              routers.<br>
                              ><br>
                              >Have you seen issues with Anycast
                              routing thus far? One would assume that<br>
                              >routing would still be fairly
                              efficient unless you're picking up transit<br>
                              >from non-local providers over extended
                              L2 links.<br>
                              <br>
                              We've had no issues so far but this was a
                              recent change. There was no<br>
                              noticeable change to outbound traffic
                              levels. <br>
                            </blockquote>
                            <div dir="auto"><br>
                            </div>
                            <div dir="auto">+1, there is no issue with
                              this approach. </div>
                            <div dir="auto"><br>
                            </div>
                            <div dir="auto">i have been taking “provider
                              routes” + default for a long time, works
                              great. </div>
                            <div dir="auto"><br>
                            </div>
                            <div dir="auto">This makes sure you use each
                              provider’s “customer cone” and SLA to the
                              max while reducing your route load /
                              churn. </div>
                            <div dir="auto"><br>
                            </div>
                            <div dir="auto">IMHO, you should only take
                              full routes if your core business is
                              providing full bgp feeds to downstrean
                              transit customers. </div>
                            <div dir="auto"><br>
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                            <blockquote class="gmail_quote"
                              style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px
                              #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><br>
                              -- <br>
                              Dan White<br>
                              BTC Broadband<br>
                              Network Admin Lead<br>
                              Ph  918.366.0248 (direct)   main:
                              (918)366-8000<br>
                              Fax 918.366.6610            email: <a
                                href="mailto:dwhite@mybtc.com"
                                target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">dwhite@mybtc.com</a><br>
                              <a href="http://www.btcbroadband.com"
                                rel="noreferrer" target="_blank"
                                moz-do-not-send="true">http://www.btcbroadband.com</a><br>
                            </blockquote>
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              </blockquote>
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