power to the internet

Thu Dec 26 15:51:50 UTC 2019

I'm pretty sure political bickering is well beyond the scope of the mailing
list. Is anyone moderating this?

- Mike Bolitho

On Thu, Dec 26, 2019, 7:20 AM Tom Beecher <beecher at beecher.cc> wrote:

> Same story again different colors. PG&E making a mint while people get
>> screwed
>>
>
> I'm not quite sure that's an accurate statement.
>
> In 2000-2001, PG&E got screwed by Enron's market manipulation. ( Good job
> those who pushed so hard for deregulation of public utility services! )
>
> PG&E is currently in bankruptcy proceedings, largely as a result of
> liabilities from wildfires in 2017 and 2018. Under California's
> application of inverse condemnation, a power utility is responsible for any
> damage caused by a wildfire if it was determined that their equipment was
> part of the cause. This applies even if the utility was in 100% compliance
> with all laws and regulations.
>
> So you have a terrible combination where housing prices in the state are
> driving more and more people to build in wildfire prone areas, climate
> change is increasing the frequency of weather conditions favorable to
> wildfire ignition, and the utility company that is being held financially
> liable for damages while at the same time not being allowed by the PUC to
> raise capital for infrastructure changes to reduce the chances of
> electrical equipment starting such things.
>
> The answer is easy. Money. If people want a power grid that is safe and
> reliable, then the utility should be given the funds to do it via rates and
> appropriate tax revenues. They should not be expected to turn profits like
> private enterprise. The power grid is for the benefit of all, not just the
> financial benefit of those who have equity stakes.
>
> This situation is the logical extension of 40+ years of America's only
> real product ; financial engineering.
>
>
> On Wed, Dec 25, 2019 at 9:18 PM Michael Loftis <mloftis at wgops.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Dec 25, 2019 at 19:00 Constantine A. Murenin <mureninc at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On Wed, 25 Dec 2019 at 19:32, Michael Thomas <mike at mtcc.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On the dark side, this is probably coming to a lot more states and
>>>> countries due to climate change. Australia. Sigh.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Do you have a source for this?  It would seem that these power issues
>>> are rather unique to California not because of some "climate change"
>>> bogeyman, but rather because of a failed public policy at the state level.
>>>
>>> It would also seem that these issues of rolling blackouts aren't even
>>> new to California, either, as, apparently, it's already been the norm
>>> during 2000/2001:
>>>
>>
>>
>> Having lived through the blackouts that was entirely different. 90% Enron
>> manipulating the markets. There was plenty of capacity both in transmission
>> and generation, but Enron manipulated prices and apparent supply to make
>> money and screwed the whole state over. There was just about 2x the
>> generating capacity, no real shortage.
>>
>> This time it’s PG&E all alone, but still fallout from back then. Too much
>> liability and they’ve not maintained the infrastructure and so they decided
>> that to reduce the liability costs it’s cheaper to blackout. Same story
>> again different colors. PG&E making a mint while people get screwed (PG&E
>> was mostly at the getting screwed end in 2000-2001)
>>
>>>
>>> * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_electricity_crisis
>>>
>>> C.
>>>
>> --
>>
>> "Genius might be described as a supreme capacity for getting its
>> possessors
>> into trouble of all kinds."
>> -- Samuel Butler
>>
>
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