AS Numbers unused/sitting for long periods of time

Wed Jan 3 15:12:22 UTC 2018

I updated all applicable records for a new client in the past month. Didn't seem that difficult. *shrugs* 

I did have control of the email server for the domain in the POCs, though. 

----- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 

Midwest-IX 
http://www.midwest-ix.com 

----- Original Message -----

From: "Steve Noble" <snoble at sonn.com> 
To: nanog at nanog.org 
Sent: Tuesday, January 2, 2018 5:11:57 PM 
Subject: Re: AS Numbers unused/sitting for long periods of time 

Inaccurate whois data from ARIN is not a good way to tell anything as 
ARIN is terrible to deal with when you need to update an address or 
phone number or anything. I know personally as I had to fight for years 
to update the data on an ASN that ARIN was billing me to manage the data 
for. 

> Chris Adams <mailto:cma at cmadams.net> 
> January 2, 2018 at 2:56 PM 
> 
> I know of two (from a former job) that pre-date ARIN that haven't been 
> used since 1999 because those two companies no longer exist (nor AFAIK 
> does any successor company). The whois information is bogus at this 
> point, but I couldn't prove that. 
> 
> I expect that AS numbers allocated by ARIN and other current RIRs are 
> not abandoned like that (since they charge annual fees, and I assume 
> they reclaim for non-payment), so the number of abandoned AS numbers is 
> probably not growing significantly (and would not grow beyond the 
> pre-RIR pool). 
> 
> With 32 bit AS numbers though, what's the point of making an effort to 
> reclaim the old AS numbers? BGP4 has been shown to handle alternate 
> length AS numbers, so if somehow 4 billion are allocated, it probably 
> won't be a big deal to extend BGP again. 
> 
> James Breeden <mailto:James at arenalgroup.co> 
> January 2, 2018 at 2:46 PM 
> Before I take this to the ARIN PPML, wanted to get NANOG's thoughts. 
> 
> 
> I'm amazed at the number of AS numbers that are assigned, but not 
> actively being used. I'm not talking just like they are offline for a 
> week or month, this is complete non-use of the AS in the global 
> routing table within *years*. They are completely abandoned resources 
> - Whois data is inaccurate by 5-10 years, no routeviews data in the 
> same time period, the owning organization (if you can find it) 
> scratches their heads about responding whether they use it or not, etc. 
> 
> 
> I know we're currently not in a push to get AS numbers or close to 
> exhaustion, but I do believe that people who have global AS numbers 
> should have a requirement to use them or return them to the global 
> pool. Am I the only one thinking this? 
> 
> 
> And before you come back with "Well they may be using it internally 
> where it doesn't need to be in the GRT" - that's why we have Private 
> AS numbers. 
> 
> 
> I.e. some form of ARIN or global policy that basically says "If AS 
> number not routed or whois updated or used in 24 months, said AS 
> number can be public noticed via mailing list and website and then 
> revoked and reissued to a pending, approved AS request" 
> 
> 
> Just thinking aloud. Happy New Year all! 
> 
> 
> James W. Breeden 
> 
> Managing Partner 
> 
> 
> 
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