Inevitable death, was Re: Verizon Public Policy on Netflix

Steve Noble snoble at
Fri Jul 18 23:34:00 UTC 2014

Hi Jared,

I know you will see the irony in my next statement..

Brett: you should talk to level 3 again, they are looking to connect to
anyone to help with Netflix connectivity.

The above URL is a great place to start.
On Jul 17, 2014 5:21 AM, "Jared Mauch" <jared at> wrote:

> On Jul 15, 2014, at 9:48 PM, George Herbert <george.herbert at>
> wrote:
> >> On Jul 15, 2014, at 5:02 PM, Brett Glass <nanog at> wrote:
> >>
> >> At 05:10 PM 7/15/2014, George Herbert wrote:
> >>
> >>> Layer3 runs right through Laramie. With a redundant run slightly
> south.  What conversations have you had with them?...
> >>
> >> At first, Level3 completely refused us. Then, they quoted us a rate
> several times higher than either of our existing upstreams for bandwidth.
> Even at that price, they refused to let us link to them via wireless
> (requiring us to either buy easements or buy land adjacent to their
> building, which sits on rented land).
> >
> > Local fiber provider?  How does everyone else tie in to Layer3 in
> Laramie?
> >
> > And, find a Layer3 reseller who can handle the cost problem.  There are
> a bunch.  I can recommend one privately if you can't find one.
> >
> > Buying retail markups from the vendor who wants to sell wholesale only
> does not scale.
> The problem is partly a technological one.  If you have a fiber span from
> east<-> west it doesn't make sense to OEO when you can just plop in a bidi
> amplifier.  That OEO cost isn't "very high", but hitting every city like
> that becomes expensive quickly.  This is why your 10G from EQUINIX-SJ to
> EQUNIX-ASH costs the same as the 10G loop from the DC to your local office.
>  The cost is the OEO ends.  If you're not in a fiber rich environment you
> are screwed.  I have at&t fiber less than 1200 feet from me but they do not
> offer any non-dialtone services in my area.  I'm all-poles to the end of
> the new comcast segment as well but due to a mid-part that doesn't have the
> density required to meet their metrics there continue to be only fixed
> wireless choices here.
> Others have suggested the UBNT gear.  I'm using it myself, but I'll say..
> it still leaves a lot to be desired.  It's mostly meant for use in less
> developed countries.  Their latest 5Ghz access gear often takes 6-12 months
> to get FCC certified to operate in the full 5ghz band.  With the recent
> opening all the way down to 5.1 this spring with the FCC that certification
> process restarted.  They are great for hopping short distances at high
> speeds in the US, but are very susceptible to interference.  (The NanoBeam,
> now PowerBeam is a bit better).
> my backhaul is 3 miles and works well for my use case.  Cheaper than the
> T1 before and higher speeds.  There's a lot of people in wispa around the
> edges you can find doing things, and many others doing it that aren't in
> wispa.  Most are small businesses (Some are larger) and suffer from poor
> business choices, but the biggest problem I see is lack of ability to get
> high speed access as Brett is commenting.  Prices may be low at the major
> DCs but out in these areas expect $10/Mb or more, sometimes not including
> loop.
> - Jared

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