Brielle Bruns bruns at
Fri Apr 6 10:37:13 CDT 2012

On 4/6/12 9:02 AM, Patrick W. Gilmore wrote:
> No, they don't.  Many DNSBLs use self-service tools.  Someone has to
> write the tool, but the rest is automated.  Total cost is power&
> space, which is frequently donated (I have personally donated some
> myself to DNSBLs I thought were well run).

Proxy removals and automated additions are self service removals.  I 
don't trust automated removal for stuff that we add by hand.  Too many 
variables, too much in the way of games...

If I were to let the people in spam-sources request removal and handle 
removal entirely on their own without one of us reviewing it by hand, 
there'd be no entries left in my database.

> Besides, anyone who knowingly causes harm to a third party and claims
> "it is a cost of doing business" or "mostly people like it" or "our
> $FOO is targeted and almost always correct, you must be an outlier
> and that's why it costs you" sound -exactly- like spammers to me.

I was more pointing out to people that you expect someone else, who 
you've got no contractual obligation with, or relationship with, to make 
time and effort to handle a request you made.

All I hear these days from people is that I have no right to tell them 
who they can have as customers, or how to run their business.

Well, the reverse applies as well.  I take great offense to people 
telling me how to run my own service, that I provide free at no charge 
with no obligations.

When a provider actually works with me to resolve an issue, I bend over 
backwards to help them.  Unfortunately, those kinds of providers are few 
and far in between.

> Spammer who are up-front about it I can deal with.  Don't agree with
> or even like them, but at least we understand each other.  Hypocrisy
> is a different story.

Unfortunately, the apathy of providers, backbones, and network operators 
in general have created an environment that the almighty buck rules 

Yeah, I've had offers for financial support of the AHBL.  Turned them 
down every time, even though it would give me a chance to hire actual 
people to run it.    But, then, I'd have someone hanging over my 
shoulder, pulling strings and interfering with my project.  My 
independence goes out the window, and I can't truly say I have no 
financial interest in the listings.

So, forgive me if my independence as a non-commercial DNSbl makes me 
somewhat jaded towards people who expect me to prioritize their demands 
over what pays the bills.

Brielle Bruns
The Summit Open Source Development Group    /

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