How do you stop outgoing spam?

Tue Sep 10 22:28:19 UTC 2002

On September 10, 2002 at 14:20 dhc2 at dcrocker.net (Dave Crocker) wrote:
 > 
 > Well, it's clear that the real point I was trying to make was entirely 
 > missed by everyone, so let me try again.
 > 
 > Dealing with problems, by focusing on absolute outbound port control, 
 > restricts legitimate use, as well as problematic use.  For a group that is 
 > largely dominated by libertarian thinking, opting for blanket, outbound 
 > port control is odd.  Very odd.

I think we do understand very well.

In a nutshell: We're hosed.

Everyone is running around willy-nilly doing things like blocking
outbound port servers, analyzing mail headers which were never meant
to be analyzed, doing full body text searching against hundreds of
regexp patterns, blocking hundreds if not thousands of IP addresses
and entire (CIDR forgive me) nets, etc.

>>At this point your easy-to-agree-with point is kinda like saying
>>   "I pay taxes, I damned well ought to be able to walk any street in any
>>    city at any time of the day or night and be safe!"
>
>No.  It is like saying that because there is some street crime, in some 
>places, let's make it illegal to walk anywhere, ever.

The word for this is "curfew" and it's not unusual in troubled areas.

>And it is like saying that because some people make obscene phone calls, 
>all phone calls will now be monitored.

All phone calls are potentially monitorable because of problems like
this.

etc etc etc let's not quibble the analogies too much.

My point is that we are now in a high crime zone, and what the "laws"
(standards) say are becoming less and less influential versus frantic
attempts to stop crime (spam.)

You can't have law without order.

Put another way, if no one will (or can) enforce the law such that
order prevails people will just do what they have to. This often
results in chaos.

1. Outlaws running crazy in the streets, drunk, raping, looting,
   tipping badly, etc.

2. Citizens meet in the church, yell at the sheriff, sheriff shrugs
   shoulders, bunch of men grab rifles and march out to confront
   outlaws themselves.

3. Massacre, vigilantes shoot each other, other honest townspeople,
   criminals laugh hysterically and vow to get drunker and have
   more fun (Dave, you've come in just about here.)

4. New sheriff comes into town, scares the crap out of everyone
   because he's so mean. Threatens to hang any citizen who takes
   law into own hands, etc.

5. New sheriff cleverly thwarts criminals while citizenry cowers
   behind closed doors and drawn curtains.

6. Law and order is restored, townspeople tearfully beg new sheriff
   to stay. Sheriff sneers, rides into sunset, next time you have to
   do it for yourselves.

7. Haunting tune whistled, credits roll.

-- 
        -Barry Shein

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