class B for sale

Michael Dillon michael at
Mon Mar 10 00:00:18 UTC 1997

On Sun, 9 Mar 1997, Jim Browne wrote:

> >The problems are *YOUR* problems and
> >it is *YOUR* responsibility to solve them as much as anyone else's.
> Wow, that sounds a lot like fingerpointing.  It's not my problem, it's
> yours.  My network isn't losing packets, the NAPs are.  My peering
> requirements are reasonable, yours aren't.  My HOL blocking isn't the
> problem, your refusal to daisy chain a second non-working device is the
> problem.  I'm sure that's not what you meant, Michael,

No, it's not what I meant. I should have said the problems are *OUR*
problems as individuals and as a group. And it is *OUR* responsibility to
solve them rather than waiting for the gods to speak. 

Aide-toi, Dieu t'aidera.

> The prevailing attitude here seems to be "If it's not my solution, you are
> part of the problem."

I disagree. If you judge people by their actions rather than by their
words there are a LOT of people silently working to make things better and
not interested in loudly proclaiming how great they are. They deserve
some thanks and the rest of us should roll up our sleeves and pitch in.
This network is still a baby. Everyone here on this list could spend the
rest of their adult life building and deploying the network and it still
wouldn't be finished.

> effective cooperation.  (Yes, CAIDA people, I know you are trying.
> However, I don't see the big six at

It's still a significantly long list. And sooner or later some network
engineer is going to figure out how to explain this to their marketing
people and the big six will start to lose contracts because they are not

> I'm beginning to think a little regulation will go a long way in correcting
> this attitude. 

One thing that would help is some legislation that draws a clear line
between what is and what is not antitrust behavior in the Internet
industry. The United States has such severe penalties for antitrust
behavior that it is understandable that companies large enough to be 
considered dominant within the industry would shy away from participating
in things like IPN. 

> Why shouldn't network metrics be standardized, published,
> and audited by an independent agency?  

They should, but...

> Car manufacturers have to publish
> results of their mandatory saftey tests.

The Internet industry has now reached the same level that the car industry
reached just after Henry Ford introduced the Model T. When Internet
engineering is as well understood as automotive engineering is today
then the standards you are looking for will come to be. It's probably no
coincidence that ANX is the major group pushing for this kind of thing.

But the tools are there for any network provider who really wants to work
on quality. ISO 9000, TQM, etc...

Michael Dillon                   -               Internet & ISP Consulting
Memra Software Inc.              -                  Fax: +1-250-546-3049             -               E-mail: michael at

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